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Author Topic: 3x05 - Angels and Monsters  (Read 11095 times)
Miguel_kiai
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« Reply #30 on: 10/15/08, 06:17:32 AM »

Wow! you guys thought this episode was unimpressive? that was the best one so far in season 3! if you ignore all the Peter's scenes it was a very good episode.

The hole Hiro stab's Ando plot MUST be part of some crazy Hiro's plan! if not they just ruinned Hiro forever!

What's worng with Peter?Huh? if Sylar power comes with a hunger for knowledge coundn't he just try to read his mother's mind? he had to  cut her open??? what the hell!
Is it a hunger for killing??? or a crave for knowledge and power?? Make up your mind writters!

Have you noticed that the vortex guy already had a Pinehearst Industries card? I wonder how many other level 5 fugitives they already recruited!?!?

I guess there's hope for a great, i mean the best season!  from now on! I can't wait to see a clash between a lot of heroes and villains!
 
« Last Edit: 10/15/08, 06:34:34 AM by Miguel_kiai » Logged

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HansPeterG
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« Reply #31 on: 10/15/08, 03:17:10 PM »

I thought Hiro can now travel things or persons through time or how would he get Adam back into the coffin?

Also he couldnt just freeze time before stabbing Ando, because Daphne cant be frozen (well or she agreed that killing Ando would be stupid). I thinking that Hiro killed Ando, but than travel'd him back to state he was 5 minutes ago... which is just fine.
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Niwdog
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« Reply #32 on: 10/15/08, 03:44:05 PM »

I seem to always do my Reviews last. Well, I watched this episode like 2 days ago, so my Memory's a bit vague. Oooh, I just remembered everything.

So starting off where we left the last episode: Hiro releasing Adam Monroe. A Great Comedy Scene, and it was funny to see how Hiro was in Control of Adam and dominating him, then a complete 360 happened later. I didn't see that whole Bar thing coming lol. I should have known better that Adam wouldn't keep his end of his bargain. So how did Knox know Adam would be there; wierd.

Morphine spoilt the Ando Death for me completely. I dunno how he/she did it, but he/she posted the ANDO'S DEAD thread in the Theories & Speculations section BEFORE the episode even aired! So I saw Hiro stabbing Ando from quite far away. However, during the episode I was just thinking, there's no way Ando dies in this episode; nothing is really indicating it, like it usually does before a character dies.

On a more lighter note, there were such fantastic comedy scenes in this episode with Hiro, ESPECIALLY: the: "We are tough badies" or something like that, and they did that riddiculous posture, had me in hives. And then when Ando said: "We're the worst Heroes ever!" or something like that.

Like most/other theorists, I do not believe Ando's permenantly dead either. I believe/trust in Hiro that he knows what he's doing, and with that IQ of 180 of his, knows what he's planning to do 8 episodes ahead. Just kidding. But there should be a really smart Hero, who really plans out a strategy of how they're going to defeat a villain, like 8 episodes before, and it should all just come together. That would be cool, and that Hero would forever be worshipped. Of course some Heroes are just beyond saving... *ahem* Maya *ahem* which leads me to my next point.

The Character of Maya is beyond saving, as it appears to me. She will never captivate, or catch-on with the majority of fans. It's quite sad too. I do find that whole crying thing she did in Season 2 annoying, but Maya imo has gotten better, and to me, she was neccessary, because I was under the impression she had something very significant/important to do at some point. I mean, her power.... Her Power... despite her crappy character was a quite interesting one, and she should have mopped the floor with Mohinder, he REALLY shouldn't have survived that long.

HOWEVER, however, however: It's been proved in the past, that talking to Maya emotively or singing to her (Alejandro), basically, audio calms her down and stops her power, so what can you do? - If it had happened differently then I'm 100% you'll all be saying; "Hey! i thought if you talk to her nicely her power stops. Something else, I found really authentic about this scene is how, Maya noticed the blood on the floor, left Mohinder, aware that he had been a bit strange lately; then came back later to investigate - It's such Human Nature. If you go to your boyfriend/girlfriend's apartment, you're not gonna be looking on the floor first, or looking for blood. I watched that scene quite carefully, to look out for blood and whether she could see it yet, because it was quite a tense scene. She noticed it at a natural time, when she was naturally looking down and made a run for it, which was Natural. It's Human Nature to be curious, so what did she Naturally do? - Come back to investigate. What followed with Mohinder returning was typical! it always happens. If you were a Maya fan, you would have been crapping your pants for her - it's only .... Natural. And what followed was only... can you guess what I'm about to say? .... Natural.

My heavy word stress of the word Natural brings me to my next point. Repitition: "Angels & Monsters"; Meredith Flame Scene - aaaargh! If I see her do that one more time...I'll stop watching! Angels & Monsters WAS said alot but you see none of this annoyed me, or I noticed it subliminally, but it didn't ruin the episode for me. It was only when someone pointed it out to me, that negativity about the episode occured to me and it dropped my rating of the episode.

Nathan - dies every episode. Prediction: Next Episode: he will die. So Nathan & Tracy are Synthetic. I can see maybe a Divide of Super-powered people, categorized as: Synthetic & (aaah... what's the other one - Atruisic!) Well apart from that, i haven't got much more to say about them. Apart from: I hope next episode you see Nathan fly-tackle Mohinder or something into the wall. Surely, you'd love to see that.

My memory is so jumbled, because I've had to watch Heroes three times, twice for 2 different Subject assessments then on TV, and it was a different episode, so I can't tell, was this the episode with the Vortex Man. He was Uber-Cool, I'm really hoping he comes back. I personally don't think he killed himself. I think the Vortex just takes him some where else. Loved how Claire found out that not everything is Black & White. And the bit when she hit the Vortex guy with the electric/zap/stun gun thingy - yeah!  Grin that's my "yeah!" moment for this episode.

Love the bit when Claire comes home to Sandra: "Meredith?" then it cuts to that creepy puppet Man scene. I'm surprised nobody mentioned that it was quite a stupid thing for her to go to the Puppet Man since she'd get trapped too, if Claire was there. With the whole amount of Criticism going on for the episode. BUT I'm not trying to help the Critics! Although that Meredith - flame thing, If I see it one more time... Meredith = Claire's Bio Mom - Claire = Peter's Uncle, which brings me to Claire's Uncle and Granny.

Peter going "Sylar" on Angella; I was really hoping he wouldn't kill her. It seems so strange now. When Angela was first introduced, i thought nothing twice of this woman. Then I grew to hate her and wanted her dead, as I learnt how caniving she was during End of Season 1-Season 2, and now I can't really tell whether she's a Villain or an Anti-hero, and it's an element that just makes me think it's really neccessary to keep her on the show from much longer.

Which brings to me my final point. Shocked what a shocking end. Well not neccessarily. Somehow I knew all the answers as if it was Innate Knowledge, yet I was still shocked. Linderman - Maury - Arthur Shocked - I remembered Guaxini's theories, and they all hit the nail on the head. I'm guessing Arthur froze Angela in her vision, and I think that's his power. It's difficult to explain and quite creative. It's not Hiro's ability, it's not Cyrokinesis, but it's not Matt/Maury's Mental Powers, but beyond that. He was able to get into her dream and freeze her from in there, and now she's stuck like a statue. I believe that has nothing to do with the Puppet Man as well. And: Arthur is SUCH a Villain! Pure Evil - killed off 2 of his Kids, without blinking twice, or at least those are part of his intentions....

Ok... it's getting too long now - I'll wrap it up. Great Episode for me. Don't think anything can top last week's for a while though, but great nonetheless.

PS: I'm joking about Not watching again because of one silly Meredith fire thing. Just having a bit of fun with the Critics, Paradizing (<that CANNOT be a real world - oh well) /Parodying I think is the right inflectional morphological lexical term, their previous posts. Although that fire thing does get to me lol
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Nathan [to Matt]: "I'm not a Cargo Jet Parkman"

Caitlin: "Besides, when you find Ricky’s killer, I wanna be there."
Peter:"What for?"
Caitlin: "To kill the bitch."
fatlucky
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« Reply #33 on: 10/15/08, 05:53:52 PM »

From the start to the end of the episode my facial expression changed from  Grin to  Roll Eyes to  Cheesy to  Shocked and even more  Shocked!! Season 3 certainly knows how to pull off shockers.
I'm putting my faith in the writers and completely ignoring plot holes that some people seem to enjoy to point at.. especially that prison!!

What fun it is to watch Nathan argue with Linderman especially since he knows it isn't real. The mystery of Linderman has been plaguing our minds for the last couple of weeks and finally we get the 'ohh' reaction upon discovering who was behind it. Maury. Pieces of the jigsaw is starting to fit together.. though it also leaves us with more questions.  Huh

Peter breaks Sylar's neck (like that would kill him, though I did enjoy watching Sylar's head dangling by his shoulder). Anyone noticed how much spit was hurled at Angela when Peter was shouting? Then he does a 'Sylar' and tries to open his mother's head, which she arguably deserves. So many secrets would be revealed if he had gotten her thoughts, but we can't have that so soon can we  Undecided

Probably the most tedious characters at the moment is Maya and Mohinder, and I'm glad at least one of them is sortof out of the way. Mohinder doesn't link with any other characters besides Maya and the people he kills for.. fun? I'm not sure what's going on with Mohinder to be honest, his character has changed so much since Season/Chapter 1.

Another character that is getting on my nerves is Meredith. First she tortures Claire and monotonously reveals her firey palm as though it was as cool as the first time. No, put it away, we don't care anymore. I do feel bad for her in the end though.. she's a puppet to that slobby guy..

Why is it not surprising that once again Claire becomes the victim. Someone out there must hate her.
She is on a mission to get revenge on the 'villains' in the company's files. I say 'villains' because the episode is so rightly named: 'Angels and Monsters', which is basically a more poetic version of 'Heroes and Villains', and the writers weren't shy about oh-so-subtly adding in the words 'monster' at every chance they could.
Claire storms into the vortex guy's house and stuns him. And I have to admit, she did look cool. And pretty. When the guy does regain consciousness, it only takes him a few moments to get even by vortexing, (dunno if that's a word, but I'll be using it a lot nonetheless) her taser to oblivion.
What got me to the edge of my seat is the fact that Claire wasn't immortal against this guy as he could make her cease to exist.. making him a potential threat to Adam, Peter and Sylar.
It turns out that this 'villain' was more human than Claire had expected and she quite unexpectedly befriends him, only to have her Dad barge in with none other than Sylar, her tormentor.
The chemistry, (nothing s*xual), between Claire and Sylar is just great to watch. He is her personal 'boogey-man'. Everyone is confused with each other's presence until the guy opens a vortex and flees. And here is the cherry on the top.. Sylar saves Claire. The irony.

Similarly, Adam Monroe has been unearthed by Hiro and is being given a second chance. Hiro is generous enough to offer him a 'bigger cell' in the future. Let's not forget that Adam is Takezo, who is Hiro's childhood hero, so seeing him toying around with Adam was certainly comical.
And don't we all love it when Hiro speaks english, his accent brings a smile to my face.  Grin
It seemed like Hiro and Ando were in control of the situation.. 2v1, teleport and stop time. But Adam proved to be quite cunning, only to be kidnapped himself.  Roll Eyes
Now we've arrived to the biggest moan of the episode. Hiro killing Ando. There is just no way Hiro would do that based on 'sacrifices'. I had to replay that scene to make sure it really was blood, and it really was Ando and it really did happen. And sure enough, it did. But why? Hiro is the one of the most morally abiding character in Heroes.  He would never ever, ever kill his best friend to prove he is 'bad'. Let's hope there is something more to this. Cry

Noah made good with his promise to find Sylar's weakness. The vortex guy could kill Sylar. But instead of becoming a 'monster', he chose to suck himself into oblivion. He was one of the few characters who could kill an immortal, so it would have been handy to keep him on the show. However, I can see how overpowered a power like that can become.. possibly the 4th season doomsday?

The end of every episode so far has left us breathless, and 'Angels and Monsters' is no different. A new company has been introduced. The company Angela is working against. The company Maury is working for. The company of Peter & Nathan's dad, Angela's husband.. Arthur Petrelli.
This guy is yet another very mysterious character, with a potentially long back story with many twists and turns. The fact that we know so little about him, yet his character has been known since Season 1 is exciting, and we do not know the extent of his powers besides telepathy, since he was communicating with Maury with his mind.

I'll leave you with a thought: 'Is Arthur Petrelli an angel or a monster?'

 Cheesy
« Last Edit: 10/15/08, 06:04:28 PM by fatlucky » Logged
xcessev
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« Reply #34 on: 10/15/08, 07:54:40 PM »

i FINALLY got a chance to read through this forum thread and i feel like i just watched monday night's episode all over again!!  geez, the reviews were so great that i don't even want to attempt a recap because you all took the words out of my mouth...and the emotions in people's responses were so passionate that my reactions while reading went from  Grin to  Roll Eyes to  Cheesy to  Shocked!!!

i COMPLETELY agree with D Rok's original post that this season is all about blurring the lines and having viewers seriously consider which side they are supporting...BEFORE jumping to conclusions.  we all know that nothing is ever really as it seems, and people are always capable of change.  whether that is a change over to the 'dark side' or vice versa is still to be determined!  plus, there are some characters that THINK that they are doing what is right for the greater good...so who are WE to judge their actions?  anyways, i think that the upcoming episodes are only going to get better and you KNOW that they are already good because of how much debate and conversations they SPARK!!  i really enjoyed monday's episode and can't wait to see more!  (except for the mohinder/maya story line Tongue)

Great reviews from GG (as always!), RG, Niwdog, and fatlucky (first time poster!)
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everyone has in them heroic powers...

the power of unconditional love,
the healing power of forgiveness,
and the power to possess unwavering faith,

...are you someone's hero?!?
aries
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« Reply #35 on: 10/15/08, 11:15:28 PM »

I can't wait to see the next episode!
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Record_Holder
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« Reply #36 on: 10/17/08, 01:31:52 PM »

Additional Questions:

1. How does the puppetman's power work?

My initial idea is that he controls the other person by controlling his/her shadow [saw it on an Anime]

Another could be that if he is within a certain distance he can control the other person, but the flaw of this is that he would be too powerful and could basically be the strongest villain of all.

My last theory is that he releases "strings" that capture his prey. These "strings" are invisible and could easily catch an unaware prey. [also borrowed the idea from an Anime]

2. How can Knox be strong enough to knockdown Adam?

My initial theory is that Knox can suck people's fear and store it. And when he uses his power, he slowly diminishes his "stock" of fear

Second theory is that Adam is still weak from being stuck in the coffin for oh so many months.

Last theory is that Knox is just effin strong and well, the momentum of Adam running combined with his natural strength knocked Adam out

3. Does the Painter Guy [sorry forgot his name] really have powers?

He makes Matt eat something and makes him listen to a certain type of music. If Matt sees exactly what this man sees, then that means the "power" can be used by any person and that the painter doesn't have any power but a talent to A: create a weird tonic to manifest this power and B: to make pretty paintings

4. Is there another break out in level 5?

In the trailer of the next episode, we see the Pyro guy as part of Arthur Petrelli's team of villains/heroes. And as we remember, the Pyro guy was captured and reimprisoned in level 5. So its either there was another break in OR the scene in the trailer is simply a glimpse into the future/past

Theories

1. Angela Petrelli's original dream is now a part of the past
2. Nathan was healed by FP not Linderman [obviously not by Linderman]
3. Arthur Petrelli has the same power as Peter [sucking other people's powers]
4. In connection to number 3, Peter inherited both of his parents powers, the ability to dream the future and the ability to suck other Heroes' abilities
5. Mohinder is collected Heroes as well, and started with the drug dealer. He is then getting their blood in hopes of finding a pattern to eventually cure himself
6. Hiro will save Ando, but he will lose Ando's trust
7. Claire will eventually work together with Sylar
8. Sylar still has all his powers, and thus he heard what Claire and HRG were talking about OR He has forgotten how to use certain powers since unlike Peter, who justs thinks of the person, Sylar has to have the knowledge on the power. Since as was noted, Sylar learns about the power.

Comments

1. The Sylar fixing Peter idea is not to far fetched
2. The Vortex guy teleporting to another realm and eventually coming back when as he pleases is a good idea
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Niwdog
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« Reply #37 on: 10/17/08, 03:12:10 PM »

Additional Questions:

1. How does the puppetman's power work?

My initial idea is that he controls the other person by controlling his/her shadow [saw it on an Anime]

My last theory is that he releases "strings" that capture his prey. These "strings" are invisible and could easily catch an unaware prey. [also borrowed the idea from an Anime]


Naruto?

I'm not sure either how this Puppet Man's powers works. I doubt it's the Shikamaru theory though. I'd put my money more on he attaches strings you can't see to you when you don't know, and before you realize it you're under his control. Or it could be a Mental thing.
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Nathan [to Matt]: "I'm not a Cargo Jet Parkman"

Caitlin: "Besides, when you find Ricky’s killer, I wanna be there."
Peter:"What for?"
Caitlin: "To kill the bitch."
xcessev
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« Reply #38 on: 10/17/08, 04:55:39 PM »

Well...whatever his power is it's obvious that Meredith knew what he was capable of since she said that he's "very dangerous"...either way, it was quite silly of her to try and take him on without any backup (even if she WAS worried about her daughter!) After all, what good are her flames against mind/body control?!
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everyone has in them heroic powers...

the power of unconditional love,
the healing power of forgiveness,
and the power to possess unwavering faith,

...are you someone's hero?!?
zena1818
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« Reply #39 on: 10/18/08, 07:21:56 PM »

ok the answer to GG q's about the whole thing where sylar should have heared what HRG was saying can be explained last season. When he was infected with the shait virus he lost almost all of the power's he gain in the last two season. So i think he losted the ablitly to hear which is why the showed him standing there not being able to hear what was said.
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kaztor007
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« Reply #40 on: 10/18/08, 08:25:07 PM »

nooo i cant believe that andoo is dead whats happend with he .....

anybody  tellme
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Manderlin
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« Reply #41 on: 10/18/08, 10:30:30 PM »

Hiro stabbed him with a sword, to get inside an evil ring.  Around here we think Ando will somehow survive.
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Every hero is on a journey to find his place in the world. But it’s a journey. You don’t start at the end. Otherwise, they can’t make a movie about it later. - Ando
joker05
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« Reply #42 on: 10/19/08, 12:41:28 PM »

it had to be planned out that maybe they thought something along those lines was bound to happen or he really did stab ando and that now we see him make another step towards becoming a villain
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Grim Reapster
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« Reply #43 on: 10/20/08, 09:27:11 AM »

I'm hoping that they did fake the whole thing, otherwise Hiro has turned into a major jerk this season. Even if he does have a way to save Ando, it's still pretty messed up to stab your best friend.

While I still love the show, and I understand that this season's about showing that everyone has the potential to be villains; Some of the things that have happened so far are really rubbing me the wrong way.

Peter turning evil.
Sylar turning good.
Mohinder the Spider-Lizard

And now Hiro being willing to kill (allegedly) his best friend in order to dig up information for Angela Petrelli?....Say it ain't so Hiro!
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zena1818
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« Reply #44 on: 10/21/08, 09:52:19 PM »

I heared hiro is going to have to:
(click to show/hide)
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